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[SoulGrower]

Hello everyone!  I am hoping someone can shed some light on this.

Last summer I received a zacatechichi plant from a seller on ebay.  It grew quickly (as you will see  ).  After it was big enough to harvest, I made a tea out of it and too my surprise.. it wasn't that bitter.  Everything I had read said how it was about as awful as anything out there.  I'm not saying it was pleasant, but it wasn't as unbearable as has been suggested.

Later that fall, it bloomed.   Again to my surprise, the flowers were not as expected.  They were small clusters of blue flowers.  Not the yellow flowers I thought it would have.

So I researched the matter and determined that I have the "non-bitter" variety that is being sold.  The vendor I made the purchase from did not describe it as the non-bitter variety.. 

My question is.. Is this even zacatechichi??  I suspect it is not.  Can anyone positively ID what plant this is?

The pic of the flower isn't that great.. this is the first bloom this spring.  The flower is blue.  I will see if I can get a better pic later

[SoulGrower]

This pic is kinda hard to see what is what.. but I wanted to show what a monster it has grown to.  It is planted next to a bouganvillea and has grown up through it.  If you look at the top of the pic, the spike at the top is the calea plant.. top/just left of center.  It is at least 8 feet tall, if not taller!

[EIRN]

different countries, same problems

and the effect?

I don't used mine yet

[Saros]

Wow, impressive! I have several small plants that are definitely of the bitter variety. I got a cutting several months ago and it and the several cuttings that I started from it have been growing quite fast. I hope to have a huge calea bush like yours one day.

I thought I had a taste for the sometimes unpleasant, bitter flavor of some medicinal herbs, but this plant is definitely the worst I've tasted by far!

1 Like EIRN likes this.

[SoulGrower]

I haven't experienced any activity from the non-bitter variety.  Worked my way up to 6oz dried leaves in tea.  Have smoke quite a bit of it.  Used for three days in a row, etc, etc...

I, hopefully, have aquired the true zacatechichi (asked seller to confirm color of flowers).. but it's only just started to grow.  Will be interesting to see if it does as well.. and if IT turns out to do anything for my dreams 

1 Like prasada likes this.

[MadPlanter]

I tried a tea of this plant a few days ago for the first time. I certainly have the bitter variety! I trimmed back a ton of leggy branches on two plants to make cuttings and figured might as well try it with the loose leaves.

I was thinking it cannot be very bad tasting its just leaves maybe people don't like the taste of leaves...ya no. Horrible tasting! Choked down a whole glass. Didn't stay a sleep the whole night. Mind was all over the place but couldn't settle to actually stay asleep. Felt markedly "off" the next day a bit but was also slightly sick so I don't know for sure.

Only gonna smoke it if I ever try it again!

Macroscopically there is a significant difference between the two varieties but the vein structure looks as if they are closely related. I'd say they are the right plants. Maybe non bitter is way weaker hence the fact its not bitter. Bitter tastes in nature often signal the presence of alkaloids. So bitter should theoretically be way stronger. Just a thought...

The non bitter one looks kinda cool though. Might need to get that one too to complete the set!

[onion]

I've grown both. I got rid of my non bitter type a couple of years ago. They are definitely two different species. I never keyed down the non bitter type, but it's in the Asteracea family. I've grown to really appreciate Calea ternifolia (aka zacatechichi) over the years..

Edit: changed terminology to ternifolia...Damon autocorrect..

[happyconcacti]

I've found seeds for the bitter variety in a store-bought pack of C.z. herb. They're definitely from the bitter variety.

Hcc

[Roze]

Bitter or not the truth is that you have a beautiful Goliath growing in your backyard!!

Well done!

[fairdinkumseeds]

Anyone ever tried to hybrid them, and did you have success?
I have a few here all starting to flower and am gonnna have a crack.
Got a large UK sold bitter which is now being sold as sweet.
Gonna try crossing with the smaller leaved white/cream flowering bitter that is really bitter.
If I just touch the flowers to each other 2x a day and bag them the rest of the time then there should be some pollen transfer hey?

[SoulGrower]

Hmm.. is the white/cream flower actually C. ternifolia?  Crossing them would be very interesting.. 

What flower does the "sweet" have?  Does it actually have a sweet flavor?!

[fairdinkumseeds]

I think that the ternifolia is the new name for zachatechichi?
None of mine are actually sweet, just that the smaller leaved bitter form is maybe twice as bitter.
This UK sourced one is still quite bitter and has much bigger leaves and stem. Both useful though.
It's pretty much the same flower, but slower to set and bigger.
Cuttings are super easy to take off it as well compared to the other ones I have.
ID could be way off, it looks it is for that vendors Lagochilus inebrians to me.
Will bag and cross them and see what I get. If the progeny looks/tastes/smells different I will be sure to post pics in the gallery.
Surely it has been done before though? Its not really a rare plant.

[Auxin]

It should be noted that people dont have to grow their plant for a year and harvest ounces before testing it.
In my experience with the genuine calea, if one medium sized leaf is bruised it will give off a sort of a buttery odor that is very distinctive.
Then chewing the leaf and swallowing the juice should produce a very distinct bitter flavor. I dont mean "is this bitter? it might taste a bit like spinach", I mean "holy crap this is bitter! quick, give me milk!"

People really need to eat more vegetables, I think. I had one guy sell me a "BITTER" calea clone. Bitter was actually in caps in the ebay item title. It was one of the fakes, not even remotely bitter. It actually tasted like mild flavored collard greens to me. I grilled the seller and his argument basically boiled down to him thinking all vegetables were "bitter". 

1 Like Psylocke likes this.

[SoulGrower]

I have finally identified this plant!

It is Chromolaena odorata, common name is Siam Weed... not calea at all. 

Looks a lot like it but the flowers are very different (the easiest way to identify bc the leaves are very similar). 

Now, there may very well be some 'non-bitter' varieties of calea as well.  There is a seller on ebay that has grown a clone sourced from World Seed Supply called 'Sweet Dreams'.  I bought one of these plants and to say that it isn't bitter is laughable.  It is painfully bitter.  Especially when compared to this Siam Weed which isn't sweet but isn't terribly bitter either.

[SoulGrower]

I never keyed down the non bitter type, but it's in the Asteracea family.

Good call Onion!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chromolaena_odorata