Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Username: Password:
Pages: [1] 2

Author Topic: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?  (Read 2838 times)

jbz711

  • Subversive Garden Installer
  • Global Moderator
  • Karma: 14
  • Posts: 184
  • Trading Score: +61
  • 8b/9a
Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« on: July 03, 2020, 05:47:48 AM »

So as an extra in a trade recently I received a 3 year old M. Turcomanica root that had recently lost all of its leaves, and I'm hoping to bring it back to life.  Does anyone have experience with growing this plant, and if so, any advice?
Logged
We must cultivate our garden. - Voltaire

jbz711

  • Subversive Garden Installer
  • Global Moderator
  • Karma: 14
  • Posts: 184
  • Trading Score: +61
  • 8b/9a
Re: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« Reply #1 on: July 03, 2020, 05:56:43 AM »

Can anyone confirm that when sources say it goes dormant in the summer they mean it is ephemeral and loses all its leaves?
Logged
We must cultivate our garden. - Voltaire

chronic

  • Senior Member
  • Karma: 25
  • Posts: 109
  • Trading Score: +97
Re: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« Reply #2 on: July 04, 2020, 12:08:18 PM »

It is normal for the plant to move in during the summer. Please do not water during this time. When it reappears, slowly start watering again. It is important to have a well-drained substrate in which no stagnant moisture forms. When the plant is at rest you can repot it. If possible not if it has leaves.

I hope you are aware of the treasure you have received with this plant. M. turcomanica (if it is the real one) is one of the rarest plants on this planet. Take good care of it so that nothing gets to it.
Logged

jbz711

  • Subversive Garden Installer
  • Global Moderator
  • Karma: 14
  • Posts: 184
  • Trading Score: +61
  • 8b/9a
Re: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« Reply #3 on: July 04, 2020, 02:11:58 PM »

Yeah, I never expected to see it in my lifetime, the root is very large and I think it's the real deal, apparently he got it from sacred succulents just a month ago. It is a heavy responsibility and I hope to be able to propagate and share it widely 8)
Logged
We must cultivate our garden. - Voltaire

chronic

  • Senior Member
  • Karma: 25
  • Posts: 109
  • Trading Score: +97
Re: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« Reply #4 on: July 04, 2020, 08:41:36 PM »

I'm very sorry for what I'm about to tell you.

I really appreciate what Sacred Succulents does and find that they have gereally good interesting genetics. However, your Turcomanica is not. What it is exactly, I don't know. Maybe a particularly vigorous officinarum or a hybrid with it.

A very good friend of mine is an absolute mandrake expert and has made an exchange with Ben Kamm in return for Greek location varieties of autumnalis. Said friend has several lines of autumnalis, officinarum, caulescens and also turcomanica. That is why it has attracted attention.  Those from the seeds of SS were slightly larger than normal officinarum, but lagged far behind true turcomanica in growth and size.

If you want to know more I will be happy to put you in contact. Alternatively I recommend his group on FB. Kynospastos - The Mandragora Enthusiast Group. One of the very few really serious groups on FB, where serious knowledge is really collected and not ignorance is managed.
Logged

jbz711

  • Subversive Garden Installer
  • Global Moderator
  • Karma: 14
  • Posts: 184
  • Trading Score: +61
  • 8b/9a
Re: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« Reply #5 on: July 05, 2020, 05:22:58 PM »

That's a bummer, still I'll grow it and see what we've got
Logged
We must cultivate our garden. - Voltaire

Yves0071

  • Member
  • Karma: 0
  • Posts: 14
  • Happy Mandrake breeder - South West France
Re: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« Reply #6 on: September 23, 2020, 08:33:23 PM »

Hi,
I am interested too by Mandragora turcomanica.
I would like to have your poijnt of view regarding this species as it seems that this name for specie has not yet been officially validated (but not rejected either).
In general, when ripe fruit and mature seeds can be encountered?
Do you know where to purchase plants or seeds?
Is seems quite close to M officinarum???
Best regards
Yves
« Last Edit: September 24, 2020, 07:03:06 AM by Yves0071 »
Logged
Mandrake breeder (Mandragora officinarum - autumnalis - caulescens)

Yves0071

  • Member
  • Karma: 0
  • Posts: 14
  • Happy Mandrake breeder - South West France
Re: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« Reply #7 on: September 24, 2020, 07:42:21 AM »

Hi,
I saw some picuture on the net but not sure it is Mandracora turcomanica?
Maybe CHRONIC can advise?
Thanks in advance!
Yves
Logged
Mandrake breeder (Mandragora officinarum - autumnalis - caulescens)

jbz711

  • Subversive Garden Installer
  • Global Moderator
  • Karma: 14
  • Posts: 184
  • Trading Score: +61
  • 8b/9a
Re: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« Reply #8 on: October 01, 2020, 05:14:48 PM »

Terrifying to leave a root in such dry soil all summer in the hot greenhouse but it looks like it paid off. When temps dropped I gave it a light watering a few weeks ago and the soil dried out quickly again, and just spotted this new growth now. Hopefully this means I'll get a shot at determining which type this is, will keep results posted.
Logged
We must cultivate our garden. - Voltaire

jbz711

  • Subversive Garden Installer
  • Global Moderator
  • Karma: 14
  • Posts: 184
  • Trading Score: +61
  • 8b/9a
Re: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« Reply #9 on: October 26, 2020, 12:09:41 PM »

A bit better picture of the progress
Logged
We must cultivate our garden. - Voltaire

Yves0071

  • Member
  • Karma: 0
  • Posts: 14
  • Happy Mandrake breeder - South West France
Re: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« Reply #10 on: October 26, 2020, 12:22:26 PM »

Hi,
Glad to see it regrowth!!!
Let see how the flowers will be : Here is the description of M turcomanica plant (description taken from Flora of the USSR), So, let's see if it fits.

1. M. turcomanica Mizgir. in Tr. Turkm. AN SSSR, II (1942)
165. — Ic: Mizgireva, I.e. fig. 1, 2.
Perennial. Leaves spreading over ground in large rosette up to 160 cm in diameter; lower leaves up to 80 cm long and 60 cm broad, broadly elliptical or ovate, in upper half usually with large, irregularly triangular teeth up to 2 cm long; upper leaves smaller, oblong-ovate or broadly lanceolate, usually without large teeth, both with crispate margins, upper surface papillose-rugose, both surfaces subglabrous, lower surface usually very sparsely hairy along ribs, hairs more numerous on young leaves. Flowers 1-3 in leaf axils, on slender sparsely pubescent, (0.5)2-3 cm long pedicels elongated up to 7-18 cm in fruit. Calyx 15-20 mm long, with ovate- or triangular-lanceolate sparsely pubescent lobes 10-15 mm long and 5-8 mm broad, with acuminate apex, accrescent and enclosing fruit up to 3/4 of its length or completely. Corolla violet, base with 3 white stripes reaching half its length, sparsely pubescent outside, 20-25 mm long, with slightly recurved, broadly ovate, subobtuse lobes about 15 mm long and 10-15 mm broad. Stamens about 10 mm long, filaments about 7 mm long, densely white tomentose at base; anthers about 4 mm long, pale blue. Style longer than stamens; stigma green. Berry globose, up to 6 cm in diameter, smooth, glossy, orange-yellow when ripe. Seeds reniform, flat, 4-5 mm long and 6-7 mm broad, yellow or light brown. Flowering from November to April. Fruiting from May to June.

On stony and rubbley slopes with thickets of Paliurus spina-christi Mill, and along dry river beds in mountain valleys at an altitude of about 500-700 m. — Soviet Central Asia: mountainous Turkmenia (western Kopet-Dag, southern foothills of the Syunt and Chokhagach mountains, in the localities of Shevlan, Shepli, Altybai, Ekechinar, Dagdanly, Sarymsakly, and Keriz). General distribution: Iran? Described from Shevlan in the southern foothills of Mt. Syunt. Type in Leningrad, isotype in Ashkhabad.

Note. Easily distinguished from related species by the following features: from M. officinarum L. by the violet (and not greenish white) corolla, pale blue (and not pale yellow) anthers, larger calyx only slightly shorter than (and not 1/3-2/5) corolla, berry almost twice as large; from M. autumnalis Spreng. — by the form and much larger size of leaves and fruits, color of anthers, larger calyx, etc.

The plant is exceptionally interesting as regards its biology; its vegetative period extends from autumn to early summer, interrupted only during the driest and hottest periods of the year: the leafy rosette develops with the beginning of the rainy season; flowering and fruit formation extends from early November to mid-April; fruits ripen from May to July, and leaves start withering in the first half of June. The plant is capable of vegetative reproduction, having numerous underground buds on its root.

M. turcomanica has not yet been studied for an assessment of its alkaloid content, but according to information supplied by Mizgireva (I.e., p. 169) it is used by local Turkmen population as a medicinal plant.


In the meantime, you can aslo investigate about plant origin to the friend who gave it to you: I am curious too!!!

Yves
« Last Edit: November 27, 2020, 07:11:21 AM by Yves0071 »
Logged
Mandrake breeder (Mandragora officinarum - autumnalis - caulescens)

jbz711

  • Subversive Garden Installer
  • Global Moderator
  • Karma: 14
  • Posts: 184
  • Trading Score: +61
  • 8b/9a
Re: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2020, 04:24:12 PM »

It is just absolutely blowing up, might not be M. Turcomanica but it's definitely much larger than M. Officinarum I've grown before
Logged
We must cultivate our garden. - Voltaire

Yves0071

  • Member
  • Karma: 0
  • Posts: 14
  • Happy Mandrake breeder - South West France
Re: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« Reply #12 on: November 26, 2020, 05:19:36 PM »

Hi JBZ,
Thanks for sharing pictures.
It seems that you will not have flowers this year. With flowers it could be better to distinguish species. In any case M turcomanica leaves looks very similar to M officinarum.
Why do you grow it in protected conditions and with artificial light?
Regards
Yves
Logged
Mandrake breeder (Mandragora officinarum - autumnalis - caulescens)

jbz711

  • Subversive Garden Installer
  • Global Moderator
  • Karma: 14
  • Posts: 184
  • Trading Score: +61
  • 8b/9a
Re: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2020, 08:20:14 PM »

Most areas in my yard it would be difficult to not water it and keeping it from the pig and chickens was a priority, and also wasn't sure if it was dormant or dead so I wanted to keep an eye on it.  It's lived in the greenhouse since I got it but the lighting you see is just supplemental.  I'm in 8b Texas which I suspect can mimic its native growing conditions once I feel brace enough to put it in the ground and I have a place for it.  Why do you say no flowers this year? As far as I know it broke dormancy when it was supposed to and has been growing fast since.  I suspect I'll have to repot it into a much deeper pot once it's dormant if I don't plant it out.
Logged
We must cultivate our garden. - Voltaire

jbz711

  • Subversive Garden Installer
  • Global Moderator
  • Karma: 14
  • Posts: 184
  • Trading Score: +61
  • 8b/9a
Re: Mandragora Turcomanica - Any advice?
« Reply #14 on: January 16, 2021, 06:00:00 PM »

It blew up in size and I started worrying about having a pot that wouldn't stunt its growth. I finally selected a site for it, the only place in the yard with sandy soil, amended it with peat moss to lower pH, and carefully planted it, then mulched with pine needles.  Here's pictures before and after transplanting:
Logged
We must cultivate our garden. - Voltaire
Pages: [1] 2