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Author Topic: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi  (Read 65950 times)

New Wisdom

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Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« on: June 25, 2014, 09:20:28 am »

Identifying "PC" Pachanoi and "Real" Pachanoi

Not a lot of people know, but most "pachanoi" being sold these days is not the plant they're expecting. I wont go into details as to why it is undesirable to most ethnobotanical cactus growers, but it's not hard to figure out.  Most of the pictures of pachanoi I see people posting here and other forums are actually PC pachanoi. This is a very beautiful plant that is great for grafting stock and ornamental reasons, but it is not much of an ethnobotanical plant like real pachanoi.  I would like to help clear some of the confusion around it and give a resource of identification for anyone looking to get some real pachanoi.  If any of you have any corrections/additions to the information I'm posting here I welcome you to post it and maybe, together, we can make a great way to identify "PC" pachanoi from real pachanoi. 

PC pachanoi

Things you will see on PC pachanoi
PC pachanoi has a very distinct look that, once trained, anyone can spot out.  The ribs have a very angular shape. When looking at the profile of the ribs it has a saw like, serrated look to it. In my experience growing this plant the spines are always the same length no matter the conditions.  They are about .5-1cm long.  The areoles and spines are facing upwards. It has a nice green color to it. The flowers have white hair on them. Real pachanoi has black hair on the flowers.
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Things you wont see on PC pachanoi
You wont see long spines, "V" notches above the areoles, black hair on the flowers, glaucus blue color (correct me if I'm wrong) ect... (Will update with more research)

Real pachanoi

Real pachanoi can vary greatly. It is not just one clone like PC pachanoi is. So I've decided to just post pictures of real pachanoi clones. The attributes I listed above under "Things you wont see on PC pachanoi" are attributes that you will find on real T. pachanoi clones.

Now I could keep on talking, but a picture says 1000 words. 

PC pachanoi Photos

Take note of the saw shape of the ribs, the upward facing areoles, and the consistant length of the spines.





PC Flowers and fruits.  Take note of the white hairs on the buds/fruits.





Real pachanoi Photos

Take note of the spine variation, V notches above the areoles, and the color of the skin.





Feel free to use this thread to ask if your pachanoi is PC or not.  Also if you have some pictures of Non-PC pachanoi I would appreciate if you post them.  This information isn't %100.  It is just what I have learned over the years.  If you have any corrections/additions please post.

Thanks to misplant for the photos of healthy mature pc.

Thanks!
New Wisdom

« Last Edit: June 20, 2016, 06:28:52 am by New Wisdom »
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Roze

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Re: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« Reply #1 on: June 25, 2014, 03:18:06 pm »

Great post NW!

Can you help to ID this little guy?

Thanks!
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happyconcacti

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Re: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« Reply #2 on: June 25, 2014, 03:47:25 pm »

Great post NW!

Can you help to ID this little guy?

Thanks!

Roze,

That looks like a T. peruvianas var. cuzcoensis because of the one long spine with a conical shape, large at the base and narrows towards the tip. What are your thoughts NewWisdom?

ID'ing unknown Trichs is fairly difficult. There's a lot of confusion around the genus.

But as New Wisdom said, once you get an eye for ID'ing PC pachanoi its fairly easy.

Hcc
« Last Edit: June 25, 2014, 03:50:22 pm by happyconcacti »
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New Wisdom

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Re: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« Reply #3 on: June 25, 2014, 05:40:35 pm »

I was thinking T. cuzcoensis as well. 
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Mandrake

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Re: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« Reply #4 on: June 25, 2014, 05:58:38 pm »

Very useful post, thank you :)

Too bad the dubious PC/Pachanoi I spotted was sold before I had the chance to pick it up myself...

Mandrake
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Greentoe

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Re: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2014, 10:32:21 pm »

Awesome write up!

Here are some of the different pachanoi I have. I don't believe any of them are PC. Most have the V-notch. I also have one that came as a gift with a bridgesii I bought. The guy said it was a San Pedro, but I'm not sure if it's a pachanoi at all.

Pic 1 T pachanoi "Claude"
Pic 2 T pachanoi "Juuls Giant"
Pic 3 T pachanoi semi-monstrose
Pic 4 T pachanoi monstrose
Pic 5 Mystery Pedro
« Last Edit: June 25, 2014, 10:54:11 pm by Greentoe »
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New Wisdom

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Re: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« Reply #6 on: June 25, 2014, 11:06:28 pm »

Those are all for sure non-PC . Nice bunch of clones. Thanks for posting.
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Greentoe

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Re: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« Reply #7 on: June 27, 2014, 01:40:19 am »

What do you think about that last one? Does it look like a pachanoi to you?
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New Wisdom

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Re: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« Reply #8 on: June 27, 2014, 04:23:16 am »

It does to me. Or at least it's in the pachanoi/peruvianus complex.  I'm not the best at IDing the whole genus trichocereus. So don't take my word on that.  I have gotten good at spotting PC though.
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Auxin

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Re: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« Reply #9 on: June 27, 2014, 08:51:06 pm »

Thought this might be of interest to some, a PC planted between two T. scopulicola clones
Note how (when they are well watered) the PC's ribs are angular and the scops are bulbous (yes, trichs are growing intercropped with kale in the background :P)


PC (left) has areoles pointing almost straight up, scop areoles angle up just a little)


Closeup of scop to show shorter thinner spines and the V notches that I think look like seagulls
« Last Edit: June 27, 2014, 08:56:00 pm by Auxin »
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marshmellow

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Re: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« Reply #10 on: July 18, 2014, 02:01:47 am »

Got some to get identified, looks to me I have a bunch of PC's but we will see
 
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New Wisdom

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Re: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« Reply #11 on: July 18, 2014, 03:37:38 am »

They all look PC to me as well. Although there are a few pachanoi clones that look just like PC, but it's more likely they are PC.
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marshmellow

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Re: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« Reply #12 on: July 18, 2014, 03:51:20 am »

Well seems I have been collecting the wrong cactus for many years. Not sure exactly what this means,  is there still of value to ethnobotanical just less value maybe? Not sure how to ask that one.  I ask because so many people have them and have have them for ethnobotanical uses ?
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EIRN

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Re: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« Reply #13 on: July 18, 2014, 03:56:51 am »

Well seems I have been collecting the wrong cactus for many years. Not sure exactly what this means,  is there still of value to ethnobotanical just less value maybe? Not sure how to ask that one.  I ask because so many people have them and have have them for ethnobotanical uses ?

 have some PC and discover the "history" here, just like you. No matter what people say, one day I will test myself.
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New Wisdom

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Re: Identifying Trichocereus pachanoi "PC" and "Real" pachanoi
« Reply #14 on: July 18, 2014, 04:06:30 am »

PC pachanoi has extremely low mescaline content, but other alkaloids are present.  Please, lets not go any further with this conversation. We will be breaking the rules shortly if we continue down this path.

New Wisdom
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