Share The Seeds
Gardening Area => Growing questions and answers => Topic started by: Mangrove on September 06, 2015, 02:02:20 AM
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My entire garden is running rampant with white flies. Under each and every leaf, they fornicate and feed on the souls of my poor and precious plants like the little white death sentences they are. I have tried using diomateceous earth to ward them off but this has done nothing. Using neem seemed to keep them off for a day or so, but they immediately returned after a few days. By now they have spread to all of my plants and I am desperate to get rid of them. Any and all advice on how to deal with these sickly swine would be more than appreciated. Any advice which is successful in eradicating this white menace will earn you karma points galore (and whatever seeds I have in my collection which you desire). I have been dealing with this plague for months and am getting desperate. It seems like anything I do seems to make them stronger and grow back in force. Help is desperately needed.
Thank you,
-Mangrove
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Try adding a small amount of coffee and a couple drops of liquid soap to the neem.
nobody
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Would syrian rue tea or concentrated black tea work in place of coffee?
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Im not sure.
nobody
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White flys have been a problem in my garden in late summer the past two years. You know it's bad when you have regular flys like crazy feeding on the stuff the white flys crap out.
After getting my ass kicked by them last year, this year I've been more proactive. They prefer the brassicas (broccoli, kale, cauliflower), so I treat them like I do aphids. Meaning, they're impossible to get rid of entirely, so the best idea is to manage them by 1) being very aggressive on young/vulnerable plants and 2) just trying to keep the numbers down enough that a strong healthy plant will outgrow the infestation.
My preferred weapon is a spray bottle with dr. Bronners peppermint soap diluted in water. I don't have a precise ratio I just kinda squirt some soap in and fill the bottle with water. Put the sprayer on mist and sneak up on them and spray the undersides of the leaves quickly as they'll fly away fast as soon as the leaves are disturbed. You can also spray the soil around the plant to get the ones that bail and land on the ground. This has to be repeated every other day for at least a week to make a serious dent, but it really doesn't take much time. Just do it in the evening so the soapy water doesn't burn the leaves.
I also found a hose attachment thing that lets you spray high pressured water on the undersides of leaves really easily. It works well against white flys and aphids, but I cant remember the brand name.
I've also tried sticky paper traps but they only caught a tiny fraction.
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You can try seaweed spray, or make a spray from concentrated tea made from eucalyptus or rue, or mix eucalyptus oil with water and a few drops of liquid soap.
A friend swears by a mix of 1 part vodka (though I think its supposed to be surgical spirits/rubbing alcohol), four parts water and a few drops of liquid soap, though I've never tried this one myself.
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Fly garlic (aminita muscara) mashed up in a bowl of water. Or spray bottle with rubbing alcohol, drop of soap, and a bit of horsetail (Equisetum) tea. It works well fir mites.
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Many thanks to all who contributed advice to me about this problem! I have some neem oil on the way and am planning on making a combative cocktail consisting of neem oil, dish soap, dr. bronner's peppermint soap, tapwater, syrian rue tea, and a couple drops of saliva from your's truly. I plan to apply this cocktail once or twice a day to the plants until the flies are running for the hills. I hope to update after a week or two with progress.
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Witches kitchen ? ;D
I really dont know, I never heard Amanita Muscaria has any desirable properties when combating pests :/ also rubbing alcohol spray will definitely help you but I guess it wont need the drop of soap or tea anymore ... the only side effect: Your plant dies too.
I recently got rid of a spidermites & white fly attack with neem oil spray and watering. But my Hovenia Dulcis wont grow anymore since then.
My advive would be: Use plain neem oil (Bayer makes a fine product) and use not more than 3ml / L as a spray. Spray until leaves upper and especially undersides are visibly treated but dont make them wet or even dripping. Spray after sun is low, never before or in full sun. Also try on one part of the plant first if youre not sure.
My 0.02$
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My advive would be: Use plain neem oil (Bayer makes a fine product) and use not more than 3ml / L as a spray. Spray until leaves upper and especially undersides are visibly treated but dont make them wet or even dripping. Spray after sun is low, never before or in full sun. Also try on one part of the plant first if youre not sure.
If you don't mind, what effects would it have on the plant of incorrectly applying neem oil? Would it burn the plant?
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I cant tell where this comes from, but: I think too high of a concentration and too much applied would lead to cloging up of the plants pores. It cant breathe anymore then.
Keep in mind the bugs must not be directly affected, the plants distribute the neem and the bugs that feed on it will have a really bad day ;)
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Yellow sticky traps help, but like sdspark said they will not catch everything.
BubbleCat - in regard to the Amanita Muscaria, folklore claims that you can add chopped up pieces of the cap to a dish of milk to trap/kill house flies. I don't know how effective it actually is, and I doubt it use could be modified into a spray. This use is supposedly why they are referred to as Fly agaric. I have no idea if this trap would work for other insects.
I would assume that the milk attracts the flies, and when they feed upon it the compounds from the mushroom poison them, or stupefy them so they then drown in the milk.
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I feel like the explanation of Amanita effects on flies is ... missing at least one leg. Dont forget even a human can probably not feed itself to death on Amanita. Insects and human organism really are way different, so to make an educated guess one would have to check the action of Amanita poisoning amd see if a fly is more, less or any vulnerable to it.
Still: If humans will fail committing suicide by taking in the pure source I can hardly imagine insects dying of a dilution.
Oh and stupefying a fly ... ? :D ... really ? :D
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That's pretty interesting kykeion, would be cool to see if it works. Flies get drunk on alcohol and end up drowning in it, so why not. I guess stranger things happen all the time ;D
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I can confirm milk makes sense tho, as in cuisine Amanita Muscaria is often treated with milk to reduce or eradicate its toxicity. So the nasties seem to be soluble in milk.
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Well like I said, folklore, and I've never tested it.
Of course now I can't find any such reference in trying to back up my claim and make sure I got the "recipe" correct.
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The name fly aminita is appropriate. The flies are in fact attracted to the fungus and are stunned by the toxicity of the mushroom. A tea with milk is the traditional approach. Paul stamets has put a great deal of research into fungi as pest control. Especially using cordyceps as they parasatize the insect and can infect entire colonies at the source. It happens in nature all the time.
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I decided to reformulate my potion to include only a few mililitres of neem and dr. bronner's (previous potion was a bit too strong). I am applying it to all my plants and juniper hedge every evening. Is once daily administration good enough? I cannot wake up early enough to get at them before the sun dawns and already after the last spraying I saw fewer flies than before :)
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Check every species for acceptance first. Otherwise you'll ent up like me with a Hovenia Dulcis that refuses to grow. Also read the packing slip (?) that came with your neem and the other product. It will tell you how frequently to use at the max.
Lastly: Please try using one of the products at a time and see if it has satisfying effect on its own, as you dont exactly know what will happen if you mix two mostly unknown substances together... and how it will affect your plants.
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Welp,
I've been spraying my plants with a dilute potion of dr. bronners and neem daily and so far I have yet to see a single white fly in my garden!! VICTORY IS MINE
I will continue to spray once in the evenings for a little bit longer and will stop soon and see if they come back. If the plague returns, this may have to become a regular thing.
some of my daggas died but some are alright. Lemon balms took a beating and pineapple sage is in remission albeit still alive (pineapple sage had the worst white fly infestation). I will take a little break for the sake of their survival and use it when necessary.
Thanks to everyone who helped me out,
-Mangrove
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You could try beneficial insects.
http://www.naturalinsectcontrol.com/subcat.php?cat=5&subcat=17
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White fly can not be controlled with yellow sticky traps, they only serve to show you have an infestation.
Any type of soap will kill them, they are not hard to kill. The problem is keeping them away. Spraying the underside with something like safer's soap will kill them but you have to do it every day on every leaf hitting the underside the most. Tough job, they are the borg.
Another thing to use is beneficial bacteria like thurigensis. Add it to a spray bottle with a little soap to help it spread out. The bacteria kill the crawlers after the eggs hatch and stop the infestation. hopefully.
Other ways include horticultural oil which smothers them as well as various poisons.
As for beneficial insects, there are lady bugs, lacewings and others. You can buy them in bulk for not too much money. That works best indoors since they will fly away outdoors but will do some good. There is also a type of fungus that kills them. I don't recall the name but its supposed to kill even whiteflies resistant to everything else.
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Encarsia formosa works really well but need 16 hrs of light for them to reproduce effectively.
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In the past I have had great success with "SNS 209 all natural systemic pest control". It's a drench made from rosemary extract 10%, rosemary oil 0.23%, water, quillaja saponin & humic acid.
Sierra Natural Science (SNS)
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There is also a type of fungus that kills them. I don't recall the name but its supposed to kill even whiteflies resistant to everything else.
spinosad maybe? Saccharopolyspora spinosa
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No, that might work fine but its chemicals derived from bacteria. A fungus approved by fda for killing whitefly is called Beauveria bassiana trade name Mycotrol-WP
Another possibility is Aschersonia. There are also predator mites and flies that will eat them.
Lady bugs are cheap, I've seen ads on ebay or amazon for a bunch costing around $10 to $15 delivered in usa. If you use them outdoors, place them late in the day at dusk so they don't fly away. Indoors that is not a problem. You might split an order with someone since you only need a few dozen for the typical indoor garden. They will lay eggs and produce more ladybugs.
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Im fond of theese things lately, so:
Yellow plastic cards with sticky glue on them help against whitefly. In sicily the whitefly on tomatoes is kept at bay with the yellow cards.
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I've never had much luck with yellow sticky cards. They are mostly for detection, they tell you what is in the garden. I have put them up and they get coated with thousands of flies but thousands more are still in the plants so it will not stop them.
Use the sticky cards to find whiteflies but then use something to get rid of them like ladybugs, lacewings, or that fungus. Do not rely on yellow cards to stop them or keep them from multiplying. Just my opinion.