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Author Topic: Help with unknown Psychotria- Is this Psychotria colorata?  (Read 450 times)

chronic

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Help with unknown Psychotria- Is this Psychotria colorata?
« on: August 14, 2019, 10:45:29 pm »

In 2012 I got two leafs of Psychotria colorata from a nice person. One of these leaves rooted and with the time I had many small plants which I distributed bit by bit. Among the shops and people who received leaves or plants from me was my friend Ralf Vogtel who now has probably the largest planting outside of South America in Ghana with this Psychotria. Many of the plants distributed everywhere today originate from him. This is a wonderful story if you know that all these plants come from only one leaf.

However, this story has a Catch. The flowers of my plants don't match the pictures you can find on google. In contrast to my white flowers ones these are like the fruits purple. A very closely related species to P.colorata, P. rosea also has colored similar looking flowers which makes the colored flowers seen from colorata on google more credible.That's why I started researching to solve the mystery. Besides P. colorata there are other psychotria that contain opioids and come from South America like Psychotria brachypoda and other. Therefore it is not impossible that it is a different species. The only thing certain is that the leaves of my plants are definitely opioid. The pictures I found point to Psychotria ernestii. Unfortunately I found nowhere information whether in this kind of Psychotria Opioid contain.

The person from whom I received my leaves about the SAB Forum I found him and he told me that he received them from a member with name Jeroen from a former forum with name Sacred Plant. Unfortunately he could not tell me more. My question now is if I can use the swarm knowledge from here and the people who also cultivate colorata can tell me how it is about the flowers and the appearance of their plants. I know that some have had their plants longer than where I started distributing my genetics internationally by the end of 2016. It would be good if I could be told which source their plants come from. No real name and address don't interest me. Gladly also about PM. I would like to publish the result of my research so that the knowledge is widely shared and I would be very happy if this secret could be finally uncovered. We have here people from Brazil and other Countrys in south america who can even maybe say more about what it is and can contribute more information.

I have consciously run the pictures over a hoster so that they are easier to recognize. Later i can run them over the forum to archive them.

Pictures of Psychotria colorata on google.

From Kew Gareden


My „P.colorata“



Unfortunately i have no picture of flowers of my plant. They look like those of P. alba or better like those of Psychotria ernestii which confirms the suspicion that they is really are P. ernestii. But what about is with the opioid effect?

Psychotria ernestii.



« Last Edit: August 15, 2019, 12:41:31 am by chronic »
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jackpot

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Re: Help with unknown Psychotria- Is this Psychotria colorata?
« Reply #1 on: October 03, 2019, 10:38:19 pm »

Hey,
I was sold a plant labelled Psychotria colorata I got mine from a African vendor, I'm not sure if sourcing is allowed so I'll leave it at that.

I've always had suspicion that the plant was misidentified has it never really resembled the image results online and now I've seen this post I'm now even more convinced that it's a misidentified plant from the Psychotria genus.
I've attached some images for people to analyse, I'm pretty sure the leaves on my plant are formed this way due to lack of humidity. But right now I don't have the finances or floor space to remedy this situation as ideally it would be nice to replicate it's natural environment.
The next time I remove a leaf I'll get a good image and upload it.

I'm not sure if the leaves work on opioid receptors or if placebo is at work and I have insufficient material to run regular and detailed tests.

Unfortunately I'm in disbelief this plant is Psychotria colorata what do you think?
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MadPlanter

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Re: Help with unknown Psychotria- Is this Psychotria colorata?
« Reply #2 on: October 03, 2019, 11:17:57 pm »

I got P. colorata from a guy in Germany a few years ago. He got it out of some botanical garden over there. Looks just like the plant you have there. Assuming that the overall ID is correct then I'd say yes you've got it.
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jackpot

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Re: Help with unknown Psychotria- Is this Psychotria colorata?
« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2019, 07:16:37 pm »

Thank you for your reply and the confirmation that it looks extremely similar to your own plant.
But just like the OP suggests I'm also in doubt that its P.Colorata and unfortunately maybe a misidentified plant, what are your thoughts?
I'm not sure if it's ok to ask but have you sampled your plant at all? and can attest to it's psychoactivity?
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chronic

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Re: Help with unknown Psychotria- Is this Psychotria colorata?
« Reply #4 on: October 04, 2019, 08:51:30 pm »

jackpot your plant is identical to mine. The guy from Africa is a friend of me who got plants a few years ago and grows them in Ghana on a plantation basis.
Because of the pictures you can find on google and the relationship to one of the real colorata closely related species, I have my doubts if it is the real one. Therefore this thread, hoping that someone has the real one or at least more information.
And yes, the plant is definitely psychoactive.


@MadPlanter
Do you happen to remember who gave you the plant? Gladly as PM. I live in Germany and I would be very interested to know from which botanical garden he got the genetics. I am also well connected in my country and know some people who work in different botanical gardens.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2019, 09:12:18 pm by chronic »
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MadPlanter

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Re: Help with unknown Psychotria- Is this Psychotria colorata?
« Reply #5 on: October 05, 2019, 08:08:33 pm »

I personally did not sample my plant but I did send some to another active member here that did. Maybe if he sees this he could comment but I won't ID him unless he wants to say something. However he reported that he did not have an effect but who knows how much was tried, whether or not conditions effect potency, etc, etc. The original guy I got the leaf cuttings from did also try the plant and reported definite psychoactivity and warned that I be careful if I ever tried it. I do believe the original guy being that we traded in the distant past several times and he seemed knowledgeable and legitimate though I cannot now remember exactly his true name or the botanical garden it came from. The other guy that is a member here I definitely believe as well with his experience report. If he could name himself willingly since he's a great and trusted member I'm sure y'all would believe his report as well. Being his report was that there was a lack of activity it would make me believe that conditions certainly effect this plants potency. However it would be totally awesome to get a real lab analysis of the plant to confirm everything. Not sure it's necessarily the true colorata either but even if it isn't and it carries anything good in it then it'd still be worth having no doubt.
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Bach

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Re: Help with unknown Psychotria- Is this Psychotria colorata?
« Reply #6 on: October 14, 2019, 06:17:17 pm »

That member would be me. The amount I tried was just a leaf or two quidded and held in the mouth for 30 min or so. The leaves tasted identical to P. alba, that is slighty bitter and astingent but nothing too bad. There were no signs of oral irritation or numbing or tingling or anything so I called it a day. 
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jackpot

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Re: Help with unknown Psychotria- Is this Psychotria colorata?
« Reply #7 on: October 14, 2019, 09:41:06 pm »

So you felt no effects at all Bach?
That's a shame this has me scratching my head even more now.
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chronic

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Re: Help with unknown Psychotria- Is this Psychotria colorata?
« Reply #8 on: October 14, 2019, 10:45:23 pm »

 One or more young leaves, part of it? Bach that surprises me very much that not much came there because it is a really powerful plant. An old big leaf normally tears the door open a good bit. But everyone is different.

« Last Edit: October 14, 2019, 11:07:18 pm by chronic »
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Chicsa

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Re: Help with unknown Psychotria- Is this Psychotria colorata?
« Reply #9 on: October 15, 2019, 01:30:26 am »

Bach which "Colorata" did you try? Was it the one you have labeled "Colorata" or is it the Elata that looks more like a colorata? (Including the flower)

Below is the P. elata you gave me with flower... It did not set seed so I don't know if it produces blue seeds or not. The flower appears to be more like the Colorata than elata.

after looking at P. Rosea it looks very very similar to the flower ive just posted, however the leafs look slightly different.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2019, 01:38:09 am by Chicsa »
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jackpot

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Re: Help with unknown Psychotria- Is this Psychotria colorata?
« Reply #10 on: October 15, 2019, 09:54:48 am »

So is there two plants in question here? The P. colorata that originated from @Chronic and a P. elata that visually looks like a Colorata?
I've recently took 4 leaf cuttings that have put out some nice growth which will feel like wasted floor space if the plant turns out to be inactive, I doubt posting pictures of the early growth being useful?

Has I stated above when I tried a few leaves I felt very little effect which could have been placebo however I have a fair amount of experience with opioids so it could have just been a tolerance issue.
My partner has zero opioid experience so shes offered to consume the next sample to see if psychoactivity is present in her opinion.
I'm yet for my main Colorata plant to flower so unfortunately haven't been able to take a look yet, Its a shame that we can't get a sample lab tested to get a definitive answer to the question, however I've no idea where to even start to get it tested.  :-\

Hopefully more light can be shed on the topic.
Peace.   
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MadPlanter

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Re: Help with unknown Psychotria- Is this Psychotria colorata?
« Reply #11 on: October 17, 2019, 06:33:56 pm »

Chicsa I'd total trade you for a leaf off that plant in your pic!

Bach tried the leaves from the plant I have. He took a small branch from my plant one time he had come to the house.

Anyone that's interested in the plant I have I could trade some leaf cuttings from. Looking for cactus cuts to revamp my collection after many losses due to a freeze. Looking especially for another js350 clone and Eileen bridgesii again. However anything considered.
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